5.Joy Lorick — Direct/Cross/Redirect/Recross
512 linesJOY LORICK, being first duly sworn, testified as follows:
COURT CLERK: Have a seat right up there, ma'am. Once you're seated, state your full name, spelling your last, please.
JOY LORICK: Joy Goldie Lorick, L-O-R-I-C-K.
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. YOUNG:
MR. YOUNG: Ms. Lorick, I need you to speak right into the microphone, okay? Is that comfortable?
JOY LORICK: Uh-huh.
MR. YOUNG: You need water?
JOY LORICK: No.
MR. YOUNG: Okay. Ms. Lorick, you were one of the babysitters for the Jones family, is that right?
JOY LORICK: Yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG: Can you tell me, how did you get to know Mr. Jones? How did you come to be involved?
JOY LORICK: Through my friend, Christina Ehlke.
MR. YOUNG: Okay. Can you tell me a little bit more about that?
JOY LORICK: What do you mean?
MR. YOUNG: Well, were you working for somebody else and then started working for Tim?
JOY LORICK: Yes. Yes. I was babysitting for another family. And the husband was -- the husband had put me through -- tried to put me through in their family stuff and I got out of it. And Ms. Ehlke was like well, Tim's looking for somebody to come keep the kids in his home. So I was like okay.
MR. YOUNG: And this was during the summer of 2014?
JOY LORICK: Yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG: And did you go to Tim's house?
JOY LORICK: Yes. I kept the kids at the house.
MR. YOUNG: And what was -- what was the condition of the house when you saw it?
JOY LORICK: It would be like dishes, clothes everywhere, trash overflowing.
MR. YOUNG: Were there bugs?
JOY LORICK: Oh, yeah. It was like a few roaches.
MR. YOUNG: It was dirty?
JOY LORICK: Yeah.
MR. YOUNG: Did you try to clean it up?
JOY LORICK: Yeah, I tried to, like, wash the dishes and tried to pick up a little bit while I was there.
MR. YOUNG: And how did that go? How was keeping the kids there?
JOY LORICK: Huh?
MR. YOUNG: How was keeping the kids there?
JOY LORICK: Oh, it was fine.
MR. YOUNG: You had all five children there?
JOY LORICK: I had all five.
MR. YOUNG: Because they weren't in school at that time?
JOY LORICK: No, at this time, everybody was out of school.
MR. YOUNG: For the summer?
JOY LORICK: For the summer.
MR. YOUNG: And did y'all decide to take a trip?
JOY LORICK: Yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG: And where did you go?
JOY LORICK: We went to the beach.
MR. YOUNG: Is that Myrtle Beach?
JOY LORICK: Myrtle Beach, yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG: Do you recall when that was?
JOY LORICK: I don't know the specific time. I know by the time we got to the beach, it was about 4:00 or 5:00 that morning. It was like early that morning. And then we got up, Mr. Jones went and got some food from McDonald's. The kids ate and then we went down to the beach for a little bit. And then after that, we left.
MR. YOUNG: And went back to Lexington?
JOY LORICK: Went back to South Carolina -- I mean, you know, went back home, so.
MR. YOUNG: Let me show you what's been marked as Defendant's Exhibit number 296 for identification. Do you recognize the date on there?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: Is that 6/27 --
JOY LORICK: Seven, uh-huh.
MR. YOUNG: 6/27/14 to check out 6/28/14?
JOY LORICK: Yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG: And that's for parking for Myrtle Beach?
JOY LORICK: Beach, yep.
MR. YOUNG: Your Honor, at this time, Defense would offer number 296 in evidence.
MS. MAYES: No objection, Your Honor.
THE COURT: 296 in without objection.
(Whereupon, Defendant's Exhibit number 296 was admitted into evidence.)
MR. YOUNG: While y'all were at the beach, did y'all -- did y'all go down to play in the ocean?
JOY LORICK: Yeah. Mr. Jones and the three oldest kids went down to the ocean and I stayed up ahead with the babies, with the two babies.
MR. YOUNG: Okay. Was there a time where Tim and the kids went swimming?
JOY LORICK: There was a time where the kids was, like, up towards the water, where the sand, where the water comes up and as I looked down, I could hear somebody screaming, like, come on, come on, come get in the water, y'all missing out. And I looked further on and Mr. Jones was like further out in the water, like way out there in the water.
MR. YOUNG: He was trying to get the kids to come out to him?
JOY LORICK: It was like he was calling the kids, he was calling everybody out. He was telling everybody they missing out on being in the water.
MR. YOUNG: And that was the first time he had ever been to the beach?
JOY LORICK: Huh?
MR. YOUNG: Did he tell you that was the first time he had ever been to the beach?
JOY LORICK: No, sir.
MR. YOUNG: Was it the first time the kids had ever been to the beach?
JOY LORICK: Not that I can recall. I don't know.
MR. YOUNG: Was there a video taken while y'all were there?
JOY LORICK: Not that I know of.
MR. YOUNG: Have you watched a video from the beach this morning?
JOY LORICK: Yes. I seen it this morning, but I don't remember that.
MR. YOUNG: Your Honor, at this time, the Defendant would offer 298, a minute video from the beach.
MS. MAYES: No objection, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Without objection.
(Whereupon, Defendant's Exhibit number 298 was admitted into evidence.)
(Whereupon, a one-minute video was played for the jury.)
MR. YOUNG: Is that Elaine down there at the beach?
JOY LORICK: That was Elaine.
MR. YOUNG: And if Elaine was down there, do you think that you were there, too?
JOY LORICK: It could have been. I just remember having her with me, so, you know, that's far back. So I can't recall them even coming to get her from me and taking her down because it was so long ago.
MR. YOUNG: Did -- shortly after that trip, you came back to Lexington, didn't you?
JOY LORICK: We went back to Lexington. Mr. Jones dropped me off at my friend, Christina's house. Her daughter was doing this type of television show thing that day, so he dropped me off there and then he went on home with his kids.
MR. YOUNG: Y'all had another trip planned?
JOY LORICK: We had another trip planned. Maybe about -- I can't remember the time, but maybe about two, three weeks after. It could have been longer than that. We went to Florida.
MR. YOUNG: Where were you going in Florida?
JOY LORICK: Sir?
MR. YOUNG: Where were you going in Florida?
JOY LORICK: We was going to Disney World. And he wanted to take the kids to Sea World.
MR. YOUNG: Let me show you what's been marked for identification, Defense Exhibit number 297. That's a receipt from Orlando, Florida?
JOY LORICK: Uh-huh.
MR. YOUNG: And does it have a date on it?
JOY LORICK: That's June 30, 2014.
MR. YOUNG: Okay. So that would have been about two days later?
JOY LORICK: I think about two days later, yeah. Because I don't know the specific -- I said it could have been two, three weeks later, but it could have been around that time, too. I don't know.
MR. YOUNG: So it could have been just a couple days?
JOY LORICK: Yeah. I'm not too specific about the time.
MR. YOUNG: Okay.
JOY LORICK: I mean, the date.
MR. YOUNG: All right.
JOY LORICK: Yeah.
MR. YOUNG: Your Honor, Defense would offer 297 into evidence.
THE COURT: Any objection?
MS. MAYES: No objection, Your Honor.
THE COURT: No objection.
(Whereupon, Defendant's Exhibit number 297 was admitted into evidence.)
MR. YOUNG: Now, on the way to Florida, did anything happen in the car?
JOY LORICK: As we was driving -- well, anybody that knows kids, like, when you driving a short -- a long period of time, kids tend to get agitated. So the kids started, like, moving around, yelling and jumping around and stuff. And Mr. Jones told them that he going to pull to the side of the road and make them get out and do squats. And I was like oh, no, you know, so.
MR. YOUNG: You thought he was serious?
JOY LORICK: Oh, yeah, yeah.
MR. YOUNG: And you stopped it?
JOY LORICK: Yeah, I was like, no, but he just kept on driving. But once he told the kids that, they just settled down. And he was like y'all just take a nap and go on to sleep and that's what they did.
MR. YOUNG: Okay.
JOY LORICK: Yeah.
MR. YOUNG: And how long did y'all stay in Disney World?
JOY LORICK: We got there that night. Mr. Jones was like -- there was a bar across the street. He was like, I'm going to go over across the street, and I was like, okay. And I stayed and I kept the kids while he went across. So we stayed like a night and then a day and then we went home that next day after Disney. After we left out Disney World, we was supposed to go to Sea World, but he was like a storm was coming, so we end up leaving that same -- the next day.
MR. YOUNG: Let me show you what's been marked for ID as Defense number 292. Are those the tickets to Sea World?
JOY LORICK: Those was the tickets.
MR. YOUNG: We'd offer Defense number 292 into evidence.
MS. MAYES: I believe there's no date on this, Your Honor. If we could just have a stipulation as to the date of this event. I would have no objection as long as there's a stipulation to the date of the trip and the date of this event.
THE COURT: Did she say late June of '14?
MR. YOUNG: Yes sir, but it's early June.
THE COURT: Okay. Early June of '14.
MR. YOUNG: Early July 2014.
THE COURT: So it was late June?
MR. YOUNG: Late June, early July, yes, sir.
THE COURT: See, I was listening.
MR. YOUNG: I'll get the exact dates and we'll put them on here.
THE COURT: All right. They'll be admitted subject to the date within reason, late June, early July.
COURT REPORTER: And that's 292?
MR. YOUNG: Yes.
(Whereupon, Defendant's Exhibit number 292 was admitted into evidence.)
MR. YOUNG: Now, Ms. Lorick, did Tim ever talk to you about his family?
JOY LORICK: No.
MR. YOUNG: Did he ever talk to you about his mother?
JOY LORICK: No.
MR. YOUNG: He never told you his mom would cut her hair off and bury it in the garden?
JOY LORICK: No.
MR. YOUNG: Did you give a statement in this case around September the 11th, 2014?
JOY LORICK: About?
MR. YOUNG: Did you give a statement --
JOY LORICK: Just a statement?
MR. YOUNG: Yeah, just a statement --
JOY LORICK: Yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG: -- to law enforcement?
JOY LORICK: Yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG: Have you reviewed your statement?
JOY LORICK: Not in a while.
MR. YOUNG: Okay. Is this your handwriting?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: And is that your signature?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: I'll just give you that to let you refresh your recollection.
JOY LORICK: Okay. Yes, I did, wrote it, but he didn't tell me that, the kids.
MR. YOUNG: Oh, the kids told you --
JOY LORICK: The kids told me that, Merah.
MR. YOUNG: About his --
JOY LORICK: Uh-huh.
MR. YOUNG: About their grandmother?
JOY LORICK: Mr. Jones never told me, the kids told me.
MR. YOUNG: Okay. And what did -- what did the kids tell you?
JOY LORICK: That she had cut her hair off and buried it in the ground and something about bones or whatever. I can't remember. I just remember that, so, you know. Kids tell you stuff like that, you know, you just kind of be like oh, okay. I was just like oh, okay.
MR. YOUNG: Was there an incident that happened in the hotel room while y'all were at Disney?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: And what happened?
JOY LORICK: What end up happening, after Mr. Jones went across the street to the bar, Nahtahn started jumping around and I asked him to stop. And Gabe just started screaming, like squealing to the top of his lungs, and I kept asking Gabe to stop. Well, by that time, Mr. Jones came back and heard it. And he was like didn't she -- I know I just heard her tell y'all to stop, y'all didn't. And he pulled down both their pants and spanked them with a belt.
MR. YOUNG: And that was in front of you?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: And what did you do?
JOY LORICK: I was just like after -- you know, I was just like, don't -- you know, stop.
MR. YOUNG: Okay. Did he stop?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: Did you have some concerns about what the children -- whether or not they were getting enough to eat?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: And why was that?
JOY LORICK: It was like when he would -- like, McDonald's, like, it would be, like, only one 20-piece nugget with two large fries and, you know, they would have to share that 20-piece nugget. Me being at the house and feeding the kids oatmeal all day. It wouldn't really be -- I probably remember one time he came back with Little Caesars pizza. It was like only one box of Little Caesars pizza. But other than that, that's what I fed the kids all day is oatmeal.
MR. YOUNG: So you were never there when he fixed dinners?
JOY LORICK: Oh, no. By that time, I would leave. I worked there from 7 a.m. to 7 p.m. at night.
MR. YOUNG: And the one time that he bought a 20-piece nugget was with you when he was in Florida?
JOY LORICK: I don't recall the 20-piece nugget when we was in Florida. I remember stopping by Chick-Fil-A --
MR. YOUNG: Okay.
JOY LORICK: -- and he went in there and he got food while me and the kids was outside. He walked inside and got food and brought it out.
MR. YOUNG: Okay.
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: But you don't remember this 20 --
JOY LORICK: No, I don't remember no 20-piece nugget. We never stopped by McDonald's.
MR. YOUNG: In Florida?
JOY LORICK: In Florida.
MR. YOUNG: On the 30th?
JOY LORICK: No, not that I remember of, but I remember it was a Chick-Fil-A.
MR. YOUNG: Okay.
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: I'm going to show you a couple of pictures, which I believe are Defendant's 268 and 269 and 270, 271, 280, 281 282, 286 and 289.
MR. YOUNG: We would offer these into evidence.
MS. MAYES: No objection, Your Honor. Those are the ones previously agreed upon.
THE COURT: All right.
(Whereupon, Defendant's Exhibit numbers 268, 269, 270 271, 280, 281, 282, 286 and 289 were admitted into evidence.)
(Whereupon, Defendant's Exhibits 272-279, 283-285, 287, 288, 290, 291, 293-295 were marked for identification only.)
MR. YOUNG: And these are pictures from when y'all were in Florida, right?
JOY LORICK: Yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG: Can you tell the jury who all is in that picture?
JOY LORICK: That is Nahtahn, Merah and Eli. That is Elaine, Merah, Nahtahn, Eli and Gabe.
MR. YOUNG: That picture has got everybody in it? Everybody except for you and Tim were in that picture?
JOY LORICK: Uh-huh. That was Merah, Eli and Nahtahn.
MR. YOUNG: Now, they appear to have badges on?
JOY LORICK: Yeah, it was like the -- if I can recall, I think it was the things to Sea World. It was like -- I can't recall what it was, it was. It was, like, badges or something. And I want to say it was, like, the badges to Sea World, like, when we go in Sea World or to the park. I can't -- it was so far back, but I know it was some type of badge or something around their necks.
MR. YOUNG: And they each one had their name on it?
JOY LORICK: I want to say yeah. If I'm not mistaken, it's so far back, so.
MR. YOUNG: But that's how you -- you used to ride rides and you get into places and buy stuff?
JOY LORICK: It was something. That is Merah, Nahtahn and Eli.
MR. YOUNG: And the hats on their heads, do you recognize those?
JOY LORICK: Not that I can recall. Not that I can remember.
MR. YOUNG: Do you ever recall those hats being put up in their rooms back at the house?
JOY LORICK: No. That is Merah, Eli and Nahtahn.
MR. YOUNG: And do you know the characters that they're with?
JOY LORICK: Woody, and I can't think of the -- that other character's name.
MR. YOUNG: And was anybody particularly fond of Woody?
JOY LORICK: Nahtahn. That is Merah and I think Nahtahn. Yeah. And I don't know who that is.
MR. YOUNG: Is that Eli over there?
JOY LORICK: Yeah, looks like him.
MR. YOUNG: Do you know who this character is?
JOY LORICK: No.
MR. YOUNG: With the long hair?
JOY LORICK: I don't know, maybe Cinderella, I'm thinking, or Sleeping Beauty.
MR. YOUNG: Could it be Rapunzel?
JOY LORICK: It could be.
MR. YOUNG: Did Merah have a particular affinity for Rapunzel?
JOY LORICK: Not that I can recall. That is Eli, Nahtahn and Merah and that is Cinderella.
MR. YOUNG: And then this -- was this at Disney or was this somewhere else?
JOY LORICK: That had to be somewhere else.
MR. YOUNG: Okay.
JOY LORICK: I don't recall that picture at all.
MR. YOUNG: But it's Gabe and Elaine eating?
JOY LORICK: Yes, that's Gabe and Elaine eating. That's Merah and I want to say that's Nahtahn. I'm not too sure, because the head's turned.
MR. YOUNG: And they're eating lunch, too?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: Now, while y'all were at Disney, did you notice Tim doing any drugs?
JOY LORICK: Sir?
MR. YOUNG: Did you notice Tim doing any drugs?
JOY LORICK: No, sir.
MR. YOUNG: Did you ever think that he was high?
JOY LORICK: Not that I know of. I do remember one morning -- I knew he smoked cigarettes, I do know that. I remember one morning of me going to the house -- like I say, had to be there at 7:00 o'clock. And I remember one morning going to the house -- going to the house, I pulled up and there was like this smell, like this chemical smell. It wasn't bleach. I clean with bleach, so I know what bleach is, but it was just like an awful smell. It makes my nose burn. And when I asked him about it, he was like, I don't know what you're talking about. And I was like, oh, that is awful. He was like, well, I got to go. I'm on my way to work. So I walked in, I checked on Elaine. She was sleeping beside her playpen in the living room. I went and checked on the other kids. And I opened up the front door to try to air it out. When the kids got up, I made them something to eat and I was like we're going outside until -- because they was like, what is that? And I was like, I don't know. It was just like an awful, awful smell. Don't know what it was. Don't know what he was doing when I got there, before I got there, but --
MR. YOUNG: That was back here in Lexington, right?
JOY LORICK: Yes, Red Bank, yes.
MR. YOUNG: So after y'all came back from Disney World, how much longer did you work with Tim Jones?
JOY LORICK: Not too much longer after that.
MR. YOUNG: Okay.
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: What happened?
JOY LORICK: I was using my dad's car and my thing was that when I got off -- my step-mom worked at the airport. So when I got off, I would have to -- sometimes I would have to go pick her up. And it was just this one particular time I got off and my dad had already picked her up. And I got to the house and I had a phone call from Mary Tanner, was like I had some mail at her house. So I was like, okay. So I went up there and I got my mail. And I came back and I could tell it was tension. So when I -- me and my sister rode to the gas station. I was like, what's going on? And she was like, I'm not getting -- I said, no, you're going to tell me what's wrong, you know. I said, I don't like walking back into the house and something going on. So my sister was like, well, daddy and them said that you don't put gas in the car. And I did, I just didn't put it in when they wanted me to put it in. And so I got gas that morning and I was just like, that's it. I'm going to give them back the car. I'm not keeping nobody's car. I just won't have no way to work. So that's the reason that I stopped keeping the kids. It was not about financial reasons. It was about that I could not make it to work without having transportation there.
MR. YOUNG: Did Tim think that you owed him money?
JOY LORICK: Yes. He told me that I -- he had paid me two weeks in advance, but I know he didn't. So he had told Ms. Ehlke, Christina, he had told her, he was like, I know that's your -- she told me that he was like, I know that's your friend, just let her know that if she doesn't pay me back, then I'll have to take further actions as far as taking her to court for my money. So my reply back to her was, well, you tell Mr. Jones he does what he has to do. Whatever he has to do, he does it.
MR. YOUNG: Okay.
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: And that was shortly before you called DSS?
JOY LORICK: That was way -- that was like before, yes.
MR. YOUNG: And you called DSS in August of 2014, right?
JOY LORICK: I think it was around about August, I want to say, yeah.
MR. YOUNG: Now, this call to DSS in August of 2014, had you been with the kids that day? Had you been with the kids in August of 2014?
JOY LORICK: Not that I can recall of. You talking about when I made the call?
MR. YOUNG: Yes, ma'am.
JOY LORICK: No, I wasn't nowhere around the kids then.
MR. YOUNG: Okay.
JOY LORICK: I just remember after I stopped keeping them, I asked Ms. Ehlke to please make sure that she fed them because I wasn't too sure how he fed them at nighttime. I just remember me feeding them oatmeal all day and I remember a certain time when they had told me -- there was one day that he was getting off work and they just kept asking for oatmeal all day and I fed them. You know, any kids, I'm going to feed them. I don't care how much that kid done ate like an hour, two hours ago, I'm going to feed them. And I remember they said, Ms. Joy, could you not tell daddy you just fed us because he might not feed us again. And I said, I would never do that to y'all.
MR. YOUNG: Were there times when there was leftover food in the fridge that they were supposed to eat?
JOY LORICK: It was one particular day, I got there to the house and -- I watched the kids Monday through Friday. And I got back -- I forgot what specific day this was, but I got back and there was something where Gabe wouldn't eat his food. And I remember I had made the kids food. I had cooked them -- was cooking them oatmeal that day. And I remember -- I can't remember who it was, but they went in the refrigerator and they pulled out this bowl. And I was like, what is that? And they was like, what's what daddy made a couple nights before, but Gabe wouldn't eat it, so he said Gabe has to eat it. They said, So Ms. Joy, Gabe has to eat that food. And I said, no, he's not. He's going to eat what we're eating now. I'm not making him. And I threw it away.
MR. YOUNG: And that was because it was Tim's policy that if the kids didn't finish their food --
JOY LORICK: They had to eat it.
MR. YOUNG: -- they had to keep eating until --
JOY LORICK: Yes. And there was also one particular time that Gabe -- it was something with Gabe. I could never figure out what it was with him, but Gabe would, like, smile, like, he would have like this smile on his face or when he chewed, he chewed with his mouth open. And I knew it was something special. And one day, I didn't know what was wrong. I said, Gabe, I said, let's chew with your mouth closed. And he closed his mouth and he opened it again. So I was like, okay, I'm not going to pressure him because something, something's wrong. And I never questioned what it was. And I remember the kids was, like, Gabe move from the table. And I was like, why? And they was like, well, last night when we was eating dinner, dad made Gabe move from the table. And he made him move from the table while the rest of them finish eating. And when they finished eating, Gabe was able to come back to the table to eat. And I was like, I'm not doing him like that.
MR. YOUNG: Were the kids ever scared of Tim?
JOY LORICK: No, not that I -- you know, I mean, they're kids. You have kids that even if they're -- you know, they loved their daddy and I know they loved their daddy. But they just knew when they did something, you could tell that they knew they was going to get in trouble or not. But no, they never seemed like they was scared of their dad.
MR. YOUNG: Was there a time where I think you took Merah to a place where a friend painted her nails?
JOY LORICK: It was a time that she was at Ms. Ehlke's house. I wasn't there and I had called to check on them. And she was telling me that her daughter had painted Merah's nails. And, I guess, you know, Merah just enjoyed getting her nails painted. And once she realized they was painted, she starts freaking out and was like -- Ms. Ehlke said she just started freaking out saying, get it off, get it off before my daddy come. And he end up coming and he was like, Merah, you know better.
MR. YOUNG: Because that was against the rules?
JOY LORICK: Because that was against the rules. They -- you know, Merah had to wear like long dresses or, like, you know, pants and stuff. Like, she couldn't wear, like, shorts or whatever or, you know. But just certain ways that he wanted his kids to dress. And fingernail polish was out of the ordinary. But no, I was not there that day. I called to check to see how they was doing and that's when Ms. Ehlke said that she -- they had painted them, when she realized they had painted, then she started freaking out.
MR. YOUNG: You thought Tim was weird?
JOY LORICK: Yeah, yeah.
MR. YOUNG: He never told you he heard voices?
JOY LORICK: No.
MR. YOUNG: He never told you that he was afraid of the kids?
JOY LORICK: Oh, no.
MR. YOUNG: Thank you, Ms. Lorick. Please answer any questions that the State has.
JOY LORICK: Okay.
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MS. MAYES:
MS. MAYES: Ms. Lorick, one of the reasons you ended up in that job is because you love kids?
JOY LORICK: Oh, yes.
MS. MAYES: Everybody knows that about you?
JOY LORICK: Oh, yes.
MS. MAYES: And these kids, you loved with your whole heart?
JOY LORICK: Oh, yes. Yes.
MS. MAYES: All five of them?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: And when you saw what you saw at Disney World, did you know at that time that there had been a DSS action where he was not supposed to lay hands on those children?
JOY LORICK: No, ma'am.
MS. MAYES: He never told you that?
JOY LORICK: Oh, no, no.
MS. MAYES: That whole time you were working for him that summer, he never once told you there is a DSS case and I'm not allowed to discipline my children --
JOY LORICK: No, ma'am.
MS. MAYES: -- by hand or by belt?
JOY LORICK: No.
MS. MAYES: And y'all spent that whole time together on the trip down there?
JOY LORICK: Uh-huh.
MS. MAYES: Eight hours, pretty much, to Orlando?
JOY LORICK: Uh-huh.
COURT REPORTER: Is that a yes?
JOY LORICK: Uh-huh.
MS. MAYES: And we'll just need you to say yes or no --
JOY LORICK: Yes, I'm sorry.
MS. MAYES: -- so she can write it down.
JOY LORICK: I'm sorry.
MS. MAYES: But y'all were in the same hotel room?
JOY LORICK: Uh-huh. Yes, ma'am.
MS. MAYES: And then the ride back together, you were in that same car?
JOY LORICK: Car, yes, ma'am.
MS. MAYES: Before that, you had taken the trip together to Myrtle Beach?
JOY LORICK: Myrtle Beach, yes.
MS. MAYES: Same car?
JOY LORICK: Same car.
MS. MAYES: Same hotel room?
JOY LORICK: Same hotel room.
MS. MAYES: So you spent hours upon hours with this man, didn't you?
JOY LORICK: Yes, ma'am.
MS. MAYES: And during that whole time, Ms. Lorick, there was never a single sign that there was anything wrong with him mentally, was it?
JOY LORICK: Oh, no, no.
MS. MAYES: He always knew exactly where --
JOY LORICK: Oh, yes --
MS. MAYES: -- he was?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: What he was doing?
JOY LORICK: Yes. He knew who I was and the kids was.
MS. MAYES: Never had any type of situation where he had a break from reality?
JOY LORICK: No.
MS. MAYES: He always knew right from wrong?
JOY LORICK: Yes, ma'am.
MS. MAYES: So he chose not to tell you that he wasn't supposed to lay hands on the kids, but when you saw it, how did it make you feel?
JOY LORICK: Kind of bad, you know. It made me feel real bad for them.
MS. MAYES: Nahtahn was six?
JOY LORICK: Nahtahn was six.
MS. MAYES: Were his pants on or down?
JOY LORICK: Down.
MS. MAYES: And was that with his hand or with a belt?
JOY LORICK: With a belt.
MS. MAYES: Gabe was two?
JOY LORICK: Two, yeah.
MS. MAYES: And he had that two-year-old pull his pants down, too, didn't he?
JOY LORICK: Yes, ma'am.
MS. MAYES: Struck him with a belt, too, didn't he?
JOY LORICK: Yes, ma'am.
MS. MAYES: Repeatedly?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: That stayed with you, didn't it?
JOY LORICK: Oh, yes, yes.
MS. MAYES: So when you made that call to DSS, Ms. Lorick, you were there with Ms. Tanner --
JOY LORICK: I was right there with her. I got to her house that day and I was just -- because we hadn't seen each other in a while. And she just basically asked me how I was doing and I got to talking. And when I talk, I just start rambling on. And I started talking about Merah and them and stuff that I felt -- you know, that I knew they was going through. And I was like, I feel like if I make that call to DSS, there's nothing going to be done. And she said, well, we're going to make this call together. And I said, okay. And that's exactly what they did, they did nothing.
MS. MAYES: So that's one of the things that weighed on you. You felt like you needed to report it, but you weren't sure whether it would lead to anything?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: Still weighed on you and you talked to Ms. Tanner about it. And the decision was made to call DSS?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: Even though in your heart you felt like --
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: -- they wouldn't do nothing --
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: Those are your words?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: And you were right there when that call was made?
JOY LORICK: Oh, yes.
MS. MAYES: That call into DSS, did it name Nahtahn as the person that had been hit at Disney World?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: Did it name Gabe, the two-year-old, as the person that had been hit at Disney World?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: Did DSS have that information?
JOY LORICK: Yes, ma'am.
MS. MAYES: That trip to Disney would have been early July, I think is the stipulation?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: So we're talking roughly seven weeks, maybe --
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: -- before the children were killed?
JOY LORICK: (Witness nods in the affirmative.)
MS. MAYES: And up until that very last time that you saw Timothy Jones and had communication with him --
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: -- Ms. Lorick, was there any doubt in your mind that he understood the communications between you?
JOY LORICK: Yes. He knew.
MS. MAYES: He was clear and rational?
JOY LORICK: He was clear, yes. When I work for a family, I like to know the parents, the grandparents. It was one particular time there was a photo album under some clothes and, I forgot, it was one of the kids that pulled it out. I said, oh, a photo album. When I go to people's house, I like to look at pictures. I like to ask questions, who is this in your family? And I was like, can I look at the album? And one of the kids pulled it out and we were looking at it and they seen their mom, they see the picture of their mom. And I said, who's that? And they said, that's mommy. I said, that's mommy? They said, yeah. They said, Ms. Joy, I wish you could meet our mommy. I said, I wish I could meet mommy, too. Because me working for a family, regardless if you a single mom, single dad, I like to know grandparents, aunt and uncles. You know, I would like to get to meet the family and stuff. And I felt that even though their mom -- even though I never got to meet their mom and no matter what her and Mr. Jones was going through, I felt that it was right that she had a right to know who was keeping her kids. That's just me. You know, I would want to know who's keeping my kids. And they did, they said that we wish that you could meet our mommy and I said, I wish that, too.
MS. MAYES: And they spoke good of their mommy?
JOY LORICK: Oh, yes, they loved their mom, yes. They told me they could not wait till they got ready to see her.
MS. MAYES: And how did the children react about that photo album when they thought their dad was coming home?
JOY LORICK: They hurried up and put it back. They -- I was like -- once we finished, they put it right back. They was like, don't tell daddy that we showed you this photo album. I said, I won't.
MS. MAYES: Because in his presence, did you ever witness the kids being able to talk positively about their mom --
JOY LORICK: Oh, no.
MS. MAYES: -- in his presence?
JOY LORICK: No. They was never allowed to talk about their mom.
MS. MAYES: Do you remember the Defendant telling you, well, the children don't have no respect for women?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: And what was your response to that?
JOY LORICK: I told him, I said, well, with me being a woman, if I'm going to be around them, they will have respect for me. So my thing with that was, you know, he had his opinion or whatever, but, you know, so.
MS. MAYES: Do you recall telling Mr. Jones that it was, in fact, him who didn't have respect for women?
JOY LORICK: Uh-huh.
MS. MAYES: Those were your words?
JOY LORICK: Yes. You could tell he was -- there was just something about women. Women should be seen and not heard.
MS. MAYES: You mentioned earlier on direct examination that the kids were hungry. How often did you see that?
JOY LORICK: A few times. A lot of times and stuff. Elaine, like, if I would be cooking or whatever, she would start and I'd be like -- I'd be like, Baby, it's almost done. Like, she would go, like, screaming, like, screaming hungry, like, she hadn't even eaten.
MS. MAYES: What would you normally feed them, Joy?
JOY LORICK: Ma'am?
MS. MAYES: What would you normally feed the children?
JOY LORICK: Oatmeal.
MS. MAYES: Was there ever a time that the Defendant seemed -- do you remember a time where he seemed concerned about a delivery?
JOY LORICK: Yes. It was supposed to be something delivered to the house from UPS. And I remember him asking me had -- he called me and asked me did the package arrive yet and I said no. Then I remember shortly after that, he ended up coming home. I don't know what he was looking for, but it was just something important that he was looking for.
MS. MAYES: Some type of package --
JOY LORICK: Some type of package, yes.
MS. MAYES: Do you remember a time where you described him smelling like an herb cabinet?
JOY LORICK: Yes. It was just something -- I don't know, it was just a faint smell.
MS. MAYES: And then the time you recall that there was some type of chemical that you could smell?
JOY LORICK: Yeah, it was a type -- I got there that morning and it was just type of -- like, you could smell it coming through the house. Coming from the house before I even walked into the house, you could just smell it. When I got in the house, it was just awful. It made my nose burn.
MS. MAYES: Do you think that was around the time of the Disney trip? Sometime that summer?
JOY LORICK: It was sometime that summer, maybe early on before. I'm not too sure.
MS. MAYES: And what do you remember about the condition of the home?
JOY LORICK: Clothes everywhere, trash overflowing, dishes everywhere. And there was a few -- there was roaches.
MS. MAYES: You described seeing him use physical punishment on the children. What --
JOY LORICK: Oh, yeah.
MS. MAYES: -- other forms of punishment do you remember seeing that appeared unusual to you?
JOY LORICK: It was where they would have to stand with one leg up, one arm out, squats. It was like different stuff. Then I remember one day Merah and Eli was like -- they called something -- it was a type of name they called something. And he was like -- Mr. Jones was like, oh, goodness, like that. And he was like, well, go show Ms. Joy what y'all talking about. I forgot the name of it. And they walk out -- Merah and Eli walks out with this big bed post, like this. And I said -- he said, well, show Ms. Joy what y'all have to do with that. And so they had it like this and they're bending down doing this. And I'm just like oh, my goodness, like, they're kids, like--
MS. MAYES: Did that appear unusual punishment to you?
JOY LORICK: Yes, oh, yes.
MS. MAYES: Ms. Lorick, you didn't know about the DSS action?
JOY LORICK: No, ma'am.
MS. MAYES: And when you made that call to DSS, you weren't aware of it?
JOY LORICK: No, ma'am.
MS. MAYES: Had there ever been a time where you, yourself, were concerned about the health of the children?
JOY LORICK: Oh, yes.
MS. MAYES: And the environment that they were in?
JOY LORICK: Yes, ma'am.
MS. MAYES: And that led you to ultimately make that call to DSS?
JOY LORICK: Yes, ma'am. Even though this time, Ms. Ehlke was keeping them, like I said, I would call her and I would inform with her that before they leave your house, you make sure you feed them. Make sure you give them something to eat because I'm not too sure what he's feeding or how much he's giving them. And she was like, you know I'm going to feed them. And I said, okay.
MS. MAYES: And you not knowing about that DSS plan, was there a time that you had a discussion with him, do you remember him having a discussion about not wanting the kids to be in school anymore?
JOY LORICK: Not wanting them to be in school. I never knew about DSS, I just know that he wanted the kids to be in school -- didn't want them to be in school and asked me would I teach them at home. And I'm like, I don't have credentials for that.
MS. MAYES: All right.
JOY LORICK: So when he would go to work, his thing was they had little laptops at the house. So when they got up, I was cooking -- Merah loved to help me cook. She loved to help me cook. And so, a lot of times she would come in the kitchen and help me. And the other ones, Nahtahn and Eli, would start doing, like, stuff, like, reading or doing math stuff. So he always wanted them to do, like, math or reading or science stuff on their little laptops or get a book out and read. So I would -- you know, I would let them do that, but yeah. I told him I did not have the credentials for them to be homeschooled.
MS. MAYES: So it was sometime after May of 2014, sometime after the school had made that report regarding Nahtahn he decided he didn't want his kids to be in public school anymore?
JOY LORICK: I would assume so, yes.
MS. MAYES: And actually wanted you to be the one homeschooling them?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: And you told him no?
JOY LORICK: I told him no, because I didn't have the credentials. I can't homeschool a child if I ain't got credentials to do it.
MS. MAYES: Thank you, Ms. Lorick.
REDIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. YOUNG:
MR. YOUNG: Ms. Lorick, when you called DSS --
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: -- in August, right?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: And you told them that the children had been beaten black and blue?
JOY LORICK: I don't recall that. I recall telling them that they was spanked with a belt, but I never said black and blue.
MR. YOUNG: Okay. So if they wrote that down, they got that wrong?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: And you told them that they weren't getting enough food?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: And that was the 20-piece chicken nugget?
JOY LORICK: That was the 20-piece chicken nugget and me feeding them oatmeal like all day, but that was me feeding them, yes.
MR. YOUNG: Now, you said he always knew the difference between right and wrong?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: You said he was always rationale?
JOY LORICK: Sir?
MR. YOUNG: You said he was always rationale? Rationale, he knew what he was doing?
JOY LORICK: Oh, yes.
MR. YOUNG: Spanking a two-year-old with a belt is not rationale, is it?
JOY LORICK: It's wrong.
MR. YOUNG: It's wrong?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: Making a two-year-old eat days old leftovers because they didn't finish their meal, that's wrong?
JOY LORICK: That's wrong.
MR. YOUNG: The way that Tim disciplined his children, that was not rationale to you?
JOY LORICK: No, it was wrong.
MR. YOUNG: And you had to tell him that was wrong?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MR. YOUNG: And there were times when you would tell him it was wrong and he would listen to you?
JOY LORICK: Well, he would listen. He would -- his thing was that women should be seen, not heard and those was his kids.
MR. YOUNG: When you told him don't pull the car over on the way to Florida, he didn't do it, right?
JOY LORICK: He didn't do it, but he did state to me those was his kids.
MR. YOUNG: And when you told him to stop spanking them in Florida, he listened?
JOY LORICK: He stopped, but I was informed those was his kids.
MR. YOUNG: Thank you, Ms. Lorick.
RECROSS-EXAMINATION BY MS. MAYES:
MS. MAYES: So the bottom line is, he was going to do what he wanted to do?
JOY LORICK: What he wanted to do because those was his kids.
MS. MAYES: Right or wrong --
JOY LORICK: Right or wrong --
MS. MAYES: -- he was going to do what he wanted to do?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: And you weren't going to tell him otherwise?
JOY LORICK: No.
MS. MAYES: Because in his mind, those were his kids?
JOY LORICK: Those was his kids.
MS. MAYES: And about the black and blue, do you remember seeing marks on Gabe after he got that whipping?
JOY LORICK: Not that I recall.
MS. MAYES: Do you remember the Defendant telling you that it was your business to keep the kids and his business to discipline them?
JOY LORICK: Yes.
MS. MAYES: Nothing further.
THE COURT: You may step down.
(Whereupon, a bench conference was held.)
THE COURT: Next witness will be -- we're going to have to break them up around lunch. I'm just trying to decide whether to go ahead and go now or not. We're going to take some testimony, then break for lunch, then we'll come back.
MR. YOUNG: Two minutes?
THE COURT: Sure. You want to send them out? Y'all want to sit here for two minutes or go to the jury room for five?
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: We're good.
THE COURT: All right, sit right here. Got two minutes.
(Whereupon, a short break for Mr. Young.)
THE COURT: All right. Call your witness.
MR. SECOR: Thank you, sir. The Defense calls Carolyn Williford.