6.Hearing on Scope of Deborah Grey’s Testimony
40 linesCASEY SECOR: Yes, sir. But before you ask for the jury to come in, I want to put something on the record.
THE COURT: Sure.
CASEY SECOR: And I understand the Court is trying to streamline the process and I understand that. I just want to put on the record that the position that I feel like I'm being put in because it makes me uncomfortable. I feel like the presentation of social history on behalf of Tim is being guided by Solicitor Hubbard's objections and that what he is okay with is allowed to come in and when something he doesn't like or that he thinks is impactful -- I'm not speaking for him, but for whatever reason he doesn't want the jury to hear it, there's an objection and the Court tells me to move along. Which I understand is what Your Honor said you would do beforehand, but I feel like I'm being put in a position of sort of like a puppet and I'm only presenting information that the State is happy with the jury hearing. And I feel like that is not advocacy, that that is not zealous advocacy. And I believe just because I -- it's just contrary to what I feel like I should be doing and need to be doing. And I feel like my doing so is depriving Tim the right to effective assistance of Counsel under the Sixth Amendment to the United States Constitution and corresponding South Carolina --
THE COURT: You don't have to go through all that.
CASEY SECOR: Yes, sir.
THE COURT: You've made all those bases but trying to streamline and trying to bring out every detail -- and Dr. Grey wants to give examples and she gives two and three when one will do is when you're getting detailed. I didn't want the testimony that Tim and Roberta thought it was self-aborted. I don't think that was necessary. She lost the baby in the hospital. I mean, I just didn't find that relevant to the facts here because Tim wasn't apprized of any of that. I thought the brother and half brother that was raised by the other people and the nurturing he got and how different he was --
CASEY SECOR: Yes, sir.
THE COURT: -- is a lot better example than losing a baby in the hospital and what a poor mother they thought Cindy was.
CASEY SECOR: And this may be my fault, but the baby, William, that Cynthia lost was lost in the home where Tim was. Tim was alive at that point.
THE COURT: He was seven months old.
CASEY SECOR: Yes, sir.
THE COURT: No, he couldn't have been seven.
CASEY SECOR: No.
THE COURT: He had to be older than that.
CASEY SECOR: Yeah, he was -- you know, I think they would have been less than a year apart, so he was very young. So, of course, having a -- you know, I couldn't ask him to tell me about his memories of that. But it's an event that occurs in the home where he is living, where his biological mother, according to people who were present, kills a baby inside of her. It's something that's witnessed by Roberta and when Senior comes home. And, obviously --
THE COURT: But the impact on Tim, Jr. is what? I don't see the relevance of Cindy's -- you called it odd behavior, it could be more graphic than that --
CASEY SECOR: Yes, sir.
THE COURT: -- the really odd behavior, perhaps, mental. Saying she lost a baby in the home is enough. I just don't think the self-mutilation goes into it. It's just -- that's getting a little too graphic for a social history.
CASEY SECOR: And I understand the Court's order and understanding, I'm not trying to argue. I would just -- as a very sort of simplistic example, if you said, would you want your infant child present for an event like that? I think any rational reasonable person would say --
THE COURT: That's the question that needs to be asking.
CASEY SECOR: Of course not.
THE COURT: That question can be asked.
CASEY SECOR: Of course, yeah. And I think that that -- I think the fact that everyone's response in that situation would be of course, I wouldn't want my infant child present for that is because we know that even if a person doesn't have a conscious memory of something, that being around for horrific events can impact a person directly, even if they can't remember it, and it certainly affects the adults that are present at that time. When the adults are present for things like that affect that child's development going forward. So that's sort of, I think, the spirit of the whole social history is that these things, even if a person doesn't have a memory of them, they're affecting the world in which they live. I'm not trying to argue with the Court.
THE COURT: No, you're trying to teach a college class now.
CASEY SECOR: I'm trying to convey what I've learned from Ms. Grey and other experts. I'm not trying to make it difficult.
THE COURT: Well, you can ask her that question, would events in the house that are traumatic and violent affect a child's development. Yes, this is because. But she doesn't need to give every single detail of the violence he was exposed to and how that changed his development, you know. That's how you can follow-up with it and that's appropriate. I mean, because you've got multitudes of examples of this. You've got eight volumes full of it. She can come on back up.
CASEY SECOR: Thank you.
THE COURT: Bring the jury.
RICK HUBBARD: And, Your Honor, just for the record, too, my objections have been based on hearsay. And that one graphic event, you ruled on yesterday.
THE COURT: I was trying to guide the limited -- she can come back up here.
CASEY SECOR: Oh, I'm sorry.
THE COURT: She's in the wrong seat.
CASEY SECOR: Yes, sir.
THE COURT: This is her seat. I was trying to guide the testimony, streamline it and that be the basis of why I'm guiding it, not at the objections of the State. The State knows I'm doing that, so I think they've been a little more cautious in the objections they've done before the --
CASEY SECOR: I wanted the Court to understand the position I felt like I was in.
THE COURT: And I put you in that position.
CASEY SECOR: Yes, sir.
THE COURT: I did.
CASEY SECOR: Yes, sir. Thank you. (Whereupon, the jury came into open court at approximately 12:00 p.m.)
THE COURT: All right. We had a short break. I talked with the clerk. Roughly, between 12:25 and 12:30 -- y'all have got 12:30 lunch reservations, so I'm going to stop some time right in there right where we are. Mr. Secor, continue.